Blackjack Rankings

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Blackjack Rankings

Post by TheHeirtotheThrone on Sat Jun 16, 2012 10:34 pm

So in Blackjack if you get a point added to your games played for every game you play. Then you get your bet back and 1 point added to your wins/score if you tie, your bet back plus your bet back again and 2 points added to your wins/score if you win, and your bet back plus double your bet and 3 points added to your wins/score if you get a blackjack.

This way if you play enough games you can get a high rank, even if you have actually lost money over all. In the current top 10, only 2 people have actually won more than they have bet, and one has broke even.

My suggestion is that the score is changed to your wins minus your bets (games played). That way the ranks will show who is the better blackjack player, rather than who plays the most. That way you would still have to play regularly to maintain a top spot, but you would also have to play well.

(Im not just saying this because I want my top spot back either Razz It makes sense, anybody can win 1000 games of black jack if they play enough, but if it takes them 3000 games to do it then they don't deserve a high rank.)
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:27 am

i think it should go by amount of money won
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Lord Arogandor on Sun Jun 17, 2012 5:02 am

Hmmm,

I see the stats here and I'm afraid that this won't be an improvement. In fact, if I would go with a ranking depending on the money won, nobody would like to play BJ anymore.

There are at this very moment only 2 players who have a profit higher then 20 bronze. And 6 others who have a profit from exactly 20 bronze.

I think the game ranking would be very unstable and not motivating for anybody.

I would prefer another system to create some dynamic in the rankings.

What about making monthly tournaments. Every month the ranking gets reset. and the 3 top players of that month gains points.
3 points for the winner.
2 points for the second.
1 point for the third.

Those winners gain access to the tournament ranking which stays forever.

If we do like this, then you can play a thousand bad games to become the monthly winner, but next month you are completely broke and another person will win the monthly tournament with a 100 good games.
In the big tournament ranking both players will have the same amount of points after the 2 months. Eventually the Seeker winning most tournaments will also be the person who or plays good, or has an endless amount of Grail Tokens Smile

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Sun Jun 17, 2012 5:19 am

that sounds fine

but honestly i dont think anyone should get a point or any sort of credit if they lose a game.

personally, it would be better to make it based on win %. i would rather have to defeat luck than simply defeat someone with more time than me.

that aside, the bids have to be made higher. i just do it now to pass time, but from someone who was nearly semi-pro at poker: in blackjack you bid on % and your bid is based on %.

if i bid 10 bronze, 5 times in a row, and lose all 5 times in a row: the odds are super high that the 6th time i will win. that is when i want to bid BIG, not just bid 20 bronze.

i understand you dont want people going broke doing this, but self control is a virtue, not a vice.


also, the town should be able to tax this stuff. who doesnt tax gambling?
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Lord Arogandor on Sun Jun 17, 2012 5:44 am

Hehe Very Happy

The BlackJack game is made for those with a little more time Smile
It is supossed to be a nice little addition to TGL. I didn't made it to have a real exact copy of the real BJ stuff.

When I finished with a lot of other things I'm willing to rebuild the blackjack ^^ until then I'm afraid you will have to deal with the version that is online now or create your own version for TGL Wink

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Tue Sep 11, 2012 4:33 am

Might be wise to get rid of grail tokens for games. Perhaps add hands twice a week tho instead. It's kinda imbalanced by grail tokens and plainly made irrelevant by this.

I'll still play, because I make money doing so. But anyone can win if they just spend grail tokens is not good way to play.
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Helfdane on Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:02 am

I agree completely. I would have won the last tournament and would be in first place in this one, if not for Carolus' grail token expenditures.

Takes the skill/luck factor out entirely.

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by JpRagavan on Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:55 pm

My thoughts on this are,

> Spending Grail tokens slightly modifies the Skill/Luck of the Players.
> It would be unfair if a person who won 18/20 games (90% success rate) Loses in tournament to someone who spends Tokens and wins 19/22 games (86.3% Success rate)

So I would suggest

>> Keep tokens out of Tournament matches (Only 14 Matches per Week per seeker)
>> If Seekers want to gain some Extra cash they can spend Tokens and play Blackjack separately. (Winnings/Losings here wont count toward Tournament Rankings but to 'All Time Rankings'*)

* A new Ranking that displays all matches played by a Seeker. ( Any match played anytime including Tournaments)

This is what I think...
Hope someone comes up with a Better Idea...Very Happy


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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Lord Arogandor on Wed Oct 03, 2012 5:40 am

I see what I can do to improve the situation.

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Wed Oct 10, 2012 8:38 pm

I got two ideas Aro, might better suit everyone-

Change the rankings to %. You can use the points method you use now to determine wins/loss ratio, even keeping blackjack the same.
Make it so unlimited hands can be played, but a minimum of 50 hands must be played to qualify. Highest win % wins tournament, can keep 2nd and 3rd place same as it is now with some total points winnings as well.

This will make the tournament based more on skill, rather than just spending grail tokens to play more which win or lose will make them victorious. Also, it removes the 'permission limit' that imo is kinda annoying. Sometimes I want to play a bit, but I get cut off. Other times, I dont feel like playing, but force myself so I do not 'lose permissions'. Makes it become a chore at times.

Another method you can use is to go by winnings only. In basic, whoever makes the most cash off blackjack within a certain amount of time, wins the tournament. In this you would probably would still want to eliminate the use of grail tokens = more games to play, lest it skew the table. However, it might not be necessary to remove it, simply because it would take obvious skill to even make money on blackjack, its debatable, which is why I favor the first idea a bit more. Also that, it does not help the poor. Someone can be an ace, but too poor to throw money around, and lose to an inferior win %.
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Lord Arogandor on Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:50 am

I want to keep those Permissions into the game. And I also want to keep the option to buy additional permissions to the game.

I however can lower the amount of permissions you gain from 3 to 2.

If more mini games will be added they will use the same permissions. It also is about making choices. Winning the tournament, or trying to gain some extra money, spending your tokens on something else Smile

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:57 pm

Lord Arogandor wrote:I want to keep those Permissions into the game. And I also want to keep the option to buy additional permissions to the game.

I however can lower the amount of permissions you gain from 3 to 2.

If more mini games will be added they will use the same permissions. It also is about making choices. Winning the tournament, or trying to gain some extra money, spending your tokens on something else Smile

Its just not a realistic way to 'win'

Anyone can spend tokens and win, with zero skill. Someone with a 90% win ratio in blackjack can lose to someone with a 50% win ratio in blackjack.

That makes any sort of 'tournament' or 'achievement' in blackjack simply 'who buy the most permissions wins'.


Right now, I only play because I am good at blackjack and I always make money playing. But I won't bother to win another tournament, because the only way to win is to abuse 'cheap' ways of playing the game. It's frustrating to consistently have a winning record, only to be overshadowed by those who take advantage of the 'cheap' way to win. It takes away from any idea of a tournament altogether.

Maybe just remove the idea of a tournament then? In any real casino, this type of play would not be allowable.
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:18 pm

I mean, just look at it right now, the top 2 people actually have a losing % in blackjack. The best winning % person is actually in 3rd place!

How can this be considered a tournament?

1Carolus7278
2Aridoto5964
3Helfdane4028
4Zealandia_Knight3428
5Luna3328
6anto_capone3128
7Brenainn2928
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Helfdane on Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:52 am

Man....I totally suck at Blackjack. I'm 3rd! Razz

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by JpRagavan on Fri Oct 12, 2012 11:09 am

Lord Arogandor wrote:I want to keep those Permissions into the game. And I also want to keep the option to buy additional permissions to the game.

I however can lower the amount of permissions you gain from 3 to 2.
A tournament where you can gain Extra permissions/turns basically removes all the Fairness in it...
Even if you reduce the permissions gained to 1 per token, it would mean the Older players have significant advantage over Newer players.
As I stated Earlier... Making tournament & casual playing different would be one way to solve it...

anto_capone wrote:
Change the rankings to %. You can use the points method you use now to determine wins/loss ratio, even keeping blackjack the same.
Make it so unlimited hands can be played, but a minimum of 50 hands must be played to qualify. Highest win % wins tournament, can keep 2nd and 3rd place same as it is now with some total points winnings as well.
I like this very much.... A player can play any number games using Tokens but winner is decided by Win/Loss ratio...
Especially after 50 games it boils down to Skill and not number of games played Very Happy

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Axel Ackland on Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:58 pm

A tournament where you can gain Extra permissions/turns basically removes all the Fairness in it...
Even
if you reduce the permissions gained to 1 per token, it would mean the
Older players have significant advantage over Newer players.
As I stated Earlier... Making tournament & casual playing different would be one way to solve it...

I think the point Aro is making is the game has a lot of things to do in it, and there are a lot of things to use grail tokens for, and in my advice there are much better options than purchasing permissions to win a blackjack tourney. So while he allows players to create advantages for the tourney, they limit themselves in other aspects of the game. I'm not sure if older players have a great advantage over newer players in this case, personally speaking I've spent my tokens, and I don't really vote for tokens.

Though I don't think there should even be tournaments for blackjack, I think the best option for one would be to make it based on winnings. A win/loss ratio I feel is based on pure luck alone, while a tourney based on winnings requires you to play the odds. This, on the other hand, would definitely favor older players, though it could work against them just as well.

But blackjack isn't even much fun, and none at all with bet limits Rolling Eyes how about a poker or euchre tournament, either would be much more fun Razz

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Lord Arogandor on Sat Oct 13, 2012 5:18 pm

Axel, you get my point Smile
It is about choosing to win and completely going for it, or just try to make extra money.

If the tournament stays but with unlimited plays then I have to remove the betting. And then at the end, all what is left is an hollow game that only a few players go for.

At least now, people play to win, to earn money or have some fun Smile

And a quick notice....Fairness is not always a goal of the Grail Lords. The Blackjack games seem to have escaped of the all seeing eyes of the Grail Lords, or they just make to much profit of it.

(I always am willing to update and improve the code whenever suggestions come, but I can only do that if I'm convinced it is a good thing to do, until now I'm convinced it BlackJack can still be improved, but not how it is suggested on the forum)

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Axel Ackland on Sat Oct 13, 2012 8:29 pm

Here's my official suggestion, Aro! Of course, I am suggesting something to make the game a lot more realistic and a little less dependent on grail lords, which I know you don't ALWAYS like.

Blackjack would be played in taverns, the ones that choose to allow it. Taverns would be controlled by players, the current towns could operate the two current taverns, but normally taverns would have to be built by either a town or player. Each tavern would have an inventory where the owner can put money into, which would then be used for payouts to blackjack (and possible other games) winners. Players cannot bet when there is no money in the tavern inventory or can not place bets more than it contains, and max (possibly min) bet limits could be created by the owner.

This would get rid of the blackjack tournament and most likely grail tokens for blackjack permissions. It would also end tavern communication between different towns.

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Wed Oct 17, 2012 5:46 pm

So the point of having a blackjack tournament is to get people to spend grail tokens?

Sorry, but thats not logical.
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Helfdane on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:01 pm

Anto is upset.

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:09 pm

i got a cold, so everything annoys me Razz
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Fri Oct 19, 2012 4:33 pm

Idk, is everyone except me flush with grail tokens?

I need many more, just to switch my combat skills- another token sink that costs way too much.
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Fri Oct 19, 2012 6:59 pm

Helfdane should be in first place, again...

Blackjack is not purely random, there is skill to the game. Can't anyone see how obvious it is when consistently the same people are at the top?
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by Helfdane on Fri Oct 19, 2012 8:23 pm

Yar. Too bad I also need tokens to switch combat skills. Not to mention up my luck skill Smile

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Re: Blackjack Rankings

Post by anto_capone on Wed Oct 24, 2012 7:51 am

oh look Helfdane, you're in first place again!

and i'm in second place!

oh wait.. Razz

Tournament Ranking

GamblerScorePlayed
1Carolus140149
2Aridoto8192
3Helfdane6856
4anto_capone6656
5Zealandia_Knight6256
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Re: Blackjack Rankings

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