The Forests Updated

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The Forests Updated

Post by Lord Arogandor on Sat Jun 29, 2013 7:29 am

Dear Seekers,

Since today it is possible to hunt on small animals in the forests of the Realm.
The hunt option is available to all Seekers but you must have equipped a Hunting Set to do so. The Hunting Set can be created in the carpenter Workshop of the Town.

Once you have your Hunting Set equipped you are ready to start a hunt, this always will take you 50 stamina and 2 hours time. Depending on your Hunting Skill you will be able to hunt more difficult animals who will give you other rare ingredients when the Hunt is successful. When starting up a hunt, you will see your base success chance (which depends on your Hunting Skill, your Aiming Skill and your Agility Skill) and an option to further increase your chances by adding additional stamina.

Just like with fishing, you are unable to do anything else while hunting. After the 2 hours, you'll know if your hunt was successful and depending on what animal you hunted, you'll receive certain goods. Those goods are unaffected from any skill and vary very little from hunt to hunt.

There also have been some changes in the Wood Cutting option:

- The formula to gather wood has been changed and the maximum amount of wood you can get has been lowered.
- Your Axe Fighting Skill has now a slight influence on the amount of Wood you chop.
- Your Strength Skill effect has been lowered.
- There no longer is an random amount of Wood Bushels.

Further more did we update the layout and tried to improve the interface so that it "feels" better.

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Cougar on Sat Jun 29, 2013 2:53 pm

What's the reason for the 2 hour wait?
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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Brown on Sat Jun 29, 2013 8:46 pm

You spend 2 hours "hunting" It works the same as fishing I think.
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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Axel Ackland on Sun Jun 30, 2013 11:27 am

Yeah I don't like the two hour wait, because in many cases people only can log in once a day.

Why was the strength factor in woodchopping nerfed??  I'm pretty positive that no one had any benefit for woodchopping from strength, already.  My suggestion would be keep the random wood amount and nerf the wood chopping skill's bonus. 

I'd like to know why you want to mix combat skills with resource skills, I mean you shouldn't just do it to one combat skill, but all of them if you do it at all.

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Lord Arogandor on Sun Jun 30, 2013 1:40 pm


 What's the reason for the 2 hour wait?

Hunting is a time consuming task and the 2 hour wait time represents this in a way. This game works with unique code for each possible option, this gives us a lot of variation in the tasks you can do. We do not work -like most other games- with a general code where only a few parameters get changed for each option you can do.




If you can only log in once a day, then I advice you not to become a hunter.





Why was the strength factor in woodchopping nerfed??  I'm pretty positive that no one had any benefit for woodchopping from strength, already.  My suggestion would be keep the random wood amount and nerf the wood chopping skill's bonus. 

With the old code, you could gather 18 wood for only 20 stamina. I lowered this to 13 wood. Without giving a set back to anybody. Like you said, nobody had profit from the strength bonus in the past because you simply got 1 wood for each 20 strength you had.

Today you always have a chance to get an extra wood bushel. That chance depends on your strength (the higher your strength, the more chance). But it indeed is limited to maximum one bushel each time.

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Cougar on Sun Jun 30, 2013 3:49 pm

Lord Arogandor wrote:

 What's the reason for the 2 hour wait?

Hunting is a time consuming task and the 2 hour wait time represents this in a way. This game works with unique code for each possible option, this gives us a lot of variation in the tasks you can do. We do not work -like most other games- with a general code where only a few parameters get changed for each option you can do.

Plowing a field is a time consuming task but there's no wait, cooking a meal is a time consuming task. I could go on. To spontaneously decide that a handful of actions work differently from everything else in the game not only makes people like me go "BANANAS" but also confuses less experienced players. That's awesome about the code, but it's irrelevant to the question. Because I can is never a reason to do.

You have a set rules about how things work in the game. Everything should work on the same principals of gameplay unless there's a reason not to, and then those rules shouldn't be completely out of whack with what's going on with everything else.

Every thing needs to make sense in the context of the game, your non answer doesn't make a bit of sense and frankly, it's hard for me not to be insulted by the complete condescending attitude of it. The some nonsense answer that makes no sense in or out of the context of the game followed by a line that basically says I'll do what I want regardless of what everyone else is doing. There's a reason they are doing it that way, and it's not always laziness. It's so once people learn the game, they can think about how to play the game not in what do I click on to get this done, but in the context of actions and profession they want to carry out.

Making some actions have nonsensical  special caveats out of context with the game or real life thinking makes this take longer.

And I want echo Axel. Frankly that's a can of worms that I don't think is wise to open in a game context of coding for those skills, and I don't see how it's relevant in real life.

Yes, your post has me damn right annoyed.


Last edited by Lord Arogandor on Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:03 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : language issue)
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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Axel Ackland on Sun Jun 30, 2013 4:15 pm

I don't mean people who can only log in once a day everyday, but I know many days I can't log in more than once, maybe twice, and noway I can log in three separate times spanning 6 hours, except sundays Razz

Fishing is similar, but still a 2 hour separation is a little ridiculous, I never was interested in fishing so I didn't make any point on that, but then 40 mins isn't as bad either.

So, this does sort of say that if you want to be a hunter, you'll need to either take breaks at work or have an irregular sleeping schedule...  Which can be detrimental to your health Razz

I see where you're coming from for the strength factor, gives people some chance now without needing 20 strength...  Buuut consider the fact it makes strength potions way pointless to use while woodchopping, not that I know if anyone used them for woodchopping before. 

How bout luck skill has a chance to get ya an extra wood too?

And again I don't think the combat skill Axe Fighting should have any affect on a resource skill.

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Lord Arogandor on Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:25 pm

Dear seekers,

I am grateful for your ideas and I appreciate your opinions. However I will not justify each decision that has been made or its reasons. Each update comes with a testing period in which we still can modify certain aspects.

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Helfdane on Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:51 pm

Cougar, you're getting to the point of simply being rude. This is Aro's game. If he wants hunting to take 2 hours, then so be it. Nobody else has an issue with it except you. 

Hunting, just like fishing, is mostly waiting. The wait times for the actions reflect this. 

Stop whining because you don't like something. The next time you want to state your opinion, do so with some respect and common courtesy; especially when addressing the owner of this game, who spends his free time making a game others can enjoy.


Last edited by Lord Arogandor on Tue Jul 02, 2013 3:55 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : language issue - read forum rules!!!!)

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Cougar on Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:52 pm

Helfdane wrote:Cougar, you're getting to the point of simply being rude. This is Aro's game. If he wants hunting to take 2 hours, then so be it. Nobody else has an issue with it except you. 

Hunting, just like fishing, is mostly waiting. The wait times for the actions reflect this. 

Stop whining because you don't like something. The next time you want to state your opinion, do so with some respect and common courtesy; especially when addressing the owner of this game, who spends his free time making a game others can enjoy.

I'm not whining, I asked a simple question out of curiosity and got an answer that didn't make sense and slight condescending, if he doesn't want or can talk about it, then he can say so the first time and not give a nonsensical answer. Respect goes both ways, and so far I still respect Aro, which is why I even bother calling things as I see them. The best way to build something is honest questioning, not unrestrained praise. And I really want to see something come out of this game, it's such a shame that there are people here who care nothing for the game and just want to butter up to the ones in charge.

As someone who is trying to be a writer(and a game designer as this applies to my game doc, can't just think of things for it now), I can tell you the best opinions I got where the ones that actually told me about what they thought was wrong or going on instead of being nice to me. Doesn't mean it was going wrong, but knowing how they took something is extremely helpful even if I don't change anything, because it's something I can use later. Even though it's now a trash chapter, it's really helpful to know that the way I did a fade away for an ending of a chapter that someone was all excited that the characters had sex, when I just intended them to have had a nice evening with music and talk. Might actually be the source why I have them so much at odds now.

Helfdane, if you want to properly attack someone, read the posts and not weakly scan them for attack points and not while bent over all puckered up either. I'm happy to talk any point of Game design with anyone who wants to actually put thought into it, not a sycophant justifying all actions of dear leader. The sad thing is you would understand this is the type of talk I want to get out of people and the conversation that I want to have and provoke and am still willing to have even with you if you'd get over the sycophantism.

As for me being rude, that's nothing but laughable crap out of a sycophant. I've done nothing but spend way to much time looking at posts on here to make sure they wouldn't be taken as an attack or something to start a fight; due to my apparent misplaced respect of Aro as someone who is interested in what his players think and making a better game rather then as a owner who does whatever and expects every to follow along because they have a batch of people that worship the ground they walk on. For the record, I don't think Aro is either of them now, so don't go running off the mouth again claiming I said things that I didn't. In fact very little of this post is about Aro, it's about you like you want it isn't it?

If you want a fight out of me, your going to have to try a lot harder on your next troll post because I've spent to much time arguing with people that can't or won't read. And I give it a few years of it and you will realize too that what your trying to start is a fruitless and self destructive endeavor. And yes, your the one starting it by intentionally misconstruing what I've said into some great attack against dear leader. I've actually given you way to much time as it is. But I feel a person should have at least one response telling them how it is.

As I have said, I'm happy to have a conversation about game design, writing or what have you. But I want to have it with people that act like adults. Not people that get bent out of shape, make up things and use an argument that has been trashed on just about every game board over some perceived slight against something they like. I'd really like this to turn out well, but unfortunately at this point I'm sure you'll never see what your doing.

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by anto_capone on Tue Jul 02, 2013 10:47 pm

Hey guys, lets keep it constructive please! Smile
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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Cougar on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:26 pm

anto_capone wrote:Hey guys, lets keep it constructive please! Smile

Would be nice.
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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Axel Ackland on Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:10 am

Can we at least address this 2 hour wait issue?  I'm fine with the wait if seekers are given an option to choose how much stamina to spend, like not 50 at a time...  So if someone wants to spend 150 stamina hunting, they can do it at once instead of having to log in 3 times between at least 6 hours.

Cougar, I think you went a little too far with your post to Helfdane... lmao

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Cougar on Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:02 pm

Axel Ackland wrote:Cougar, I think you went a little too far with your post to Helfdane... lmao

Maybe, but he hit a nerve. I really really really want to talk game design, or writing, or something creative. I'm more then willing to call it water under the bridge if we can just get to the discussion and not let it be turned into a RK style troll and flame.

The wait doesn't bother me one bit, I just don't get it. Why does going out to the forest and setting a bunch of traps need a wait time where beating the ^!#% out of a chunk of metal to shape it into something doesn't? Does seem a lot like Aro is trying to mimic what RK has done with their game. That's another sore spot with me. Hey I signed up for this game, played it a few years, wait it's another game now what? But that's something that's something else.

Yeah, it's just not clicking with me.
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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by JpRagavan on Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:48 pm

I understand what you mean cougar XD

I've always thought everything should be evenly made Very Happy

> Either all jobs require a certain amount of time (x, y, z mins), or
> All jobs doesn't require any amount of time (ie immediately)

Having any combo of both seems mismatched to me... Suspect 
But following either one of the methods has it's own advantages and disadvantages...

Since I favour more realism I'd go with option 1 even though waiting can become a pain sometimes XD

Anyways this is my opinion... :LOL1:

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by aridoto on Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:17 pm

Solutions to those who dislike the hunting as it is now Very Happy:

1. don't hunt, try to do something else cos there are many other options of earning coins;

2. investigate the problem (what involves hunting and why you don't agree with the idea of the 2 hours wait) and propose a real solution and try to live with the fact that it might not be applier (remember you are not playing alone so everybody might propose a different thing and the owner can only change it in one way);

3. criticizing an idea without arguments doesn't bring progress => better not to criticize.

My explanation for the 2 h wait: Aro likes random, a lot of this game is about having variation as you might have already noticed.

Question: what does RK has to do with TGL hunting?

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Cougar on Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:09 pm

Aridoto, what little of your post I can figure out doesn't make any sense, or like mentioning RK, could have been done by reading the post. If there is something you are referring to of mine that I can clear up then I would be happy to do so if you can make it clearer what your are talking about. 

But to be frank, your post reeks of someone who hasn't even read the thread, and I'm not reiterating the entire conversation for you, there's already the making of one flame war due to someone making false attacks and another breaking unwritten forum rule of posting angry(me). Before jumping on any band wagons you should read the thread entirely, and follow your own number 3.

JP, Since the entire game is an abstraction, I personally favor the way it is with 90% of the game, not to mention it's simpler to stick with what's already there.

The consistency issue isn't a matter of opinion, at least not in the eyes of people like Richard Bartle(MUD) or Game Designer Jessie Snell or many other game designers whose works I've read.

It's good to have variety of things in a game, but it needs to make sense. When someone comes across something that works differently, it should work both in and out of context of the game, when explained simply the player should understand.

 I've actually criticized games because the spell system was exactly the same as the regular fighting system, so people can stop with this idea that I'm arguing that everything should be exactly the same. It just needs to make sense and be organic with the game and fit with the consistency of the game world and game mechanics. It wouldn't make any sense to add PVP combat and deciding the winner by making them play Tic Tac Toe would it? That's a bit extreme but that's roughly the idea I'm trying to get across, even in a game like this there is a sense of immersion. Immersion isn't built off realism, it's built off consistency. Consistency isn't doing everything the same, but everything making sense in it's place.

D&D has the first good example that came to mind of this being pulled off successfully, now keep in mind I'm taking 3.0. A wizard and a Sorcerer do the exact same thing basically. They cast magic, they do however do it very differently from each other. One has learned rituals and memorizes spells and has a spell book, the other is an innate spell caster the casts with their own will. It's a very different system to do the exact same thing in a different way and it makes perfect sense within the context and consistency of the game.

It's fun if it make sense.
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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by aridoto on Thu Jul 04, 2013 3:38 am

I see you like writing, Cougar Very Happy. Cool down and stop thinking you're the center of our attention. Not everything is about you Very Happy. I can see your main interest here is to get in a continuous discussion and not to solve something. Sorry for my post, your instigation is not worth my time.

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Re: The Forests Updated

Post by Lord Arogandor on Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:05 am

This "discussion" is going nowhere and I have absolutely no message at this. Enough time has been used on making and reading long and completely needless posts, so this topic has been closed.

Thanks for the criticism, I'm aware that this is meant to help me further improving TGL.

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